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Post by pokeria1 on Jan 16, 2009 17:45:51 GMT -5
Hmmm,scream?. That's an awful idea (Only because it's The Little Mermaid II) and that whould never work,you"re forgetting that Disney don't count this and only count the original Little Mermaid and maybe Ariel's Beginning,Melody isn't really exits and I"m pretty sure that they don't know who Morgana is and did you really liked Little Mermaid II?. If this has anything to do with the plot errors in TLM 2 (or the original TLM series) that links up with the original TLM, There have been instances with canon materials, not just with TLM, but in any mainstream source, where they have plot errors that contradict even in the original source. I mean, for a good example, which I used multiple times, in the Cell Games Saga, when Cell returns to Earth after blowing himself up, he says in the original manga that he survived because his head was intact. However, during his fight with Goku, Goku used the warp Kamehameha which blew off the entire top half of his body, and he still survived that. In fact, this plot error was noted by TV.com to be one of the biggest plotholes in DBZ. I mean, unless Akira Toriyama was out and someone else wrote that error into his manga, even the original manga, which is claimed to be the ultimate canon of DBZ, is going to be riddled with these kinds of errors. My point is, if the Cell Games saga of the DBZ manga (Or, heck, the Majin Buu saga, even) can still be considered part of the ultimate source of canon despite the gratuitous amount of errors in them, TLM II can still be considered a canonical part of the TLM franchise. Now, other than the Disney Princess line, the only thing in the franchise I may NOT be able to count as canon, whether Disney made it or not, is probably AB, as it has far too many errors to even think of placing it in canon. I mean, Flounder, other than his massive revamp, they didn't even explain how he even got into the nervous wreck that he was in the first movie. Plus, the way Ariel and Flounder acted towards each other seemed more like they were friends for... well... more than they were in AB. Ursula was never mentioned in the movie at all, or even the reason why she was banished in the first place, for that matter. Music was supposedly banned, and yet in the first movie, they were acting like Music was never banned, especially since "Daughters of Triton" worded their song/debut of Ariel as if anything was a first, it's her becoming a member of a band. Plus, Ariel's origins of her fascination on humanity was not even covered in the movie (Yes, I know they covered it on the TV series, but considering how oh, so many people think it isn't canon, they might have changed the backstory.). Honestly, I don't care if Tara Strong wasn't voicing Melody. they should have stuck with their original draft of TLM III. besides, if they could replace Flounder's VA for AB, they can certainly find a suitable replacement for Melody's VA. I don't see why they would rewrite it just because Tara Strong said she wasn't voicing Melody. BTW, on TV.com, apparantly the TLM movie was supposed to have aired after the TV series aired, but for some reason, they decided to air it before the TV series. Onto the topic, I may not have liked TLM 2, but I personally won't mind a TV series about it. Hey, if the Godzilla tv series became a hit despite it originating from the failed Godzilla remake, I'm pretty sure a TLM TV series sequel would have done better. Besides, they could use it to clear up any plotholes as to why certain things happened (eg, how the grotto was fixed), maybe give actual backstory to Morgana, if needs be. |
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Post by tnadav1 on Jan 16, 2009 17:53:42 GMT -5
Look,the examples you"re giving aren't right because every company is different,they might be different but Disney when they do something beside the film (Like the series,comics,Return To The Sea and etc.) don't count,the Princess line counts because it's a line about Ariel and other Disney female heroes,it's not something like Ariel,Giselle and Jasmine go visit Aurora in her castle or Snow White and Mulan go to Belle's castle,what you mean is things like Kingdom Hearts with things like Jafar and Maleficent planning to take over all the Disney worlds and House Of Mouse with TinkerBell and Jiminy Cricket eating dinner togehter.
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Post by pokeria1 on Jan 16, 2009 18:16:45 GMT -5
Look,the examples you"re giving aren't right because every company is different,they might be different but Disney when they do something beside the film (Like the series,comics,Return To The Sea and etc.) don't count, Personally, if that was the case, I really don't see much of a point in even making them and putting created by Disney on it. I mean, I can understand things like toys and all that, but why even put their name onto some work of art/continutity archive if they weren't planning on it counting as part of the franchise. Besides, if the TV series didn't count to Disney as canon, despite them being the ones who made the series in the first place, then why have Ariel recognize Ursula the very minute Flotsam and Jetsam mentioned her. I mean, the way they did that line implied that Ariel and Ursula had encountered each other before (which was what happened in the series, anyways.). BTW, do you have a source backing up your statement about Disney not really caring about those things as being canon (Like an interview, some press notes, directors notes, something like that?). How is any different? And anyways, I was just mentioning how Ariel's Beginning doesn't count as canon due to the majority of the movie being riddled with so many errors it simply could not be placed into canon, even IF I had watched it and enjoyed it. Now, since you mentioned the Disney Princess line, I've noticed the artwork on the shelves, and apparantly, some princesses are with each other, implying that they know each other. So, I don't see how that is any different compared to KH, anyways. |
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Post by Jazzy on Jan 18, 2009 13:40:27 GMT -5
I would say.....please wake me up with this TLM nightmare is over. No way never. Enough of the TLM remakes...additions...sequels...musicals.....rubbish nonsense crap. It is all awful. They are ruining everything, they wouldn't do this anyways I am sure. The age of TLM is over. Let it rest in the glory it still has left. I don't want anymore Ariel stories that are terrible. I don't want anymore oh it would be cool to have this. No it wouldn't it would suck, we'd be disappointed and annoyed at how bad Disney does this and that. Let it go people...let it go....
-rant over-
The ONLY thing I am and would look forward to is the TLM dark ride they are putting in at DL and MAY put in at WDW.
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Post by ariel101 on Jan 18, 2009 14:55:16 GMT -5
Oh thats cool whats the dark ride of the little mermaid going in DL and WDW? Sorry getting off topic, But after the 20th annaverisay I think they are done with Ariel. Nobody really makes a big thing about Ariel.
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Post by Random Prince on Jan 18, 2009 15:45:18 GMT -5
I would say.....please wake me up with this TLM nightmare is over. No way never. Enough of the TLM remakes...additions...sequels...musicals.....rubbish nonsense crap. It is all awful. They are ruining everything, they wouldn't do this anyways I am sure. The age of TLM is over. Let it rest in the glory it still has left. I don't want anymore Ariel stories that are terrible. I don't want anymore oh it would be cool to have this. No it wouldn't it would suck, we'd be disappointed and annoyed at how bad Disney does this and that. Let it go people...let it go.... -rant over- The ONLY thing I am and would look forward to is the TLM dark ride they are putting in at DL and MAY put in at WDW. I feel the same way. I'm just so thankful that I was a kid at the time when it was all really high quality - the TV show, series of books, music and everything else. I will always enjoy those aspects of TLM and have happy memories.  I'm sure there will be things to look forward to in the future, like the ride, but it's very sad to see how messed up Disney is at the moment. |
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Post by tnadav1 on Jan 21, 2009 11:24:40 GMT -5
Look,the examples you"re giving aren't right because every company is different,they might be different but Disney when they do something beside the film (Like the series,comics,Return To The Sea and etc.) don't count, Personally, if that was the case, I really don't see much of a point in even making them and putting created by Disney on it. I mean, I can understand things like toys and all that, but why even put their name onto some work of art/continutity archive if they weren't planning on it counting as part of the franchise. Besides, if the TV series didn't count to Disney as canon, despite them being the ones who made the series in the first place, then why have Ariel recognize Ursula the very minute Flotsam and Jetsam mentioned her. I mean, the way they did that line implied that Ariel and Ursula had encountered each other before (which was what happened in the series, anyways.). BTW, do you have a source backing up your statement about Disney not really caring about those things as being canon (Like an interview, some press notes, directors notes, something like that?). Well,when I think it's just to see new stories about Ariel but don't count it as a canon,thought you"re right about how they put their names on it and release if when they don't count. It's just that they always ignore the sequels and other stuff,like Ariel's Beginning seems to ignore the series,I have examples of other films (Like Beauty And The Beast II doesn't make sense with the original movie,the Fairies line (Espically the books) ignore Return To Neverland because in Return To Neverland TinkerBell is still with Peter but in the Fairies line,Tink is still angry with Peter because of what happened to Wendy so she left him and went back to Pixie Hollow,where she used to live before she met him),also you don't see characters from sequels and they do denial many of them,The Cinderella III director said that he ignroed Cindy II. Because in the Princess line the Princesses can't even looks on each other,you don't see things like Cinderella and Tiana talking to each other althought they do things like sitting together and even singing,look at my siggy,they don't even look on each other,it's their policy,but in Kingdom Hearts and House Of Mouse you see characters talking to each other and more. Jazzy-Ariel's Beginning and the musical weren't bad,the series was pretty good,I whouldn't mind seeing things like more Ariel stories but really not things like Little Mermaid II,thought there's only dark ride at the parks and Ariel's Enchanted Tale.... until the new Platinum Edition will be released on Blu-Ray. |
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Post by pokeria1 on Jan 21, 2009 16:29:18 GMT -5
Personally, if that was the case, I really don't see much of a point in even making them and putting created by Disney on it. I mean, I can understand things like toys and all that, but why even put their name onto some work of art/continutity archive if they weren't planning on it counting as part of the franchise. Besides, if the TV series didn't count to Disney as canon, despite them being the ones who made the series in the first place, then why have Ariel recognize Ursula the very minute Flotsam and Jetsam mentioned her. I mean, the way they did that line implied that Ariel and Ursula had encountered each other before (which was what happened in the series, anyways.). BTW, do you have a source backing up your statement about Disney not really caring about those things as being canon (Like an interview, some press notes, directors notes, something like that?). Well,when I think it's just to see new stories about Ariel but don't count it as a canon,thought you"re right about how they put their names on it and release if when they don't count. Well, It's nice to see that we agree on at least one thing in regards to this debate. Well, I guess you may be right about "Neverland"/"Fairies" and Cinderella III/II. But I don't know about your use of TLM III is a good example since, unlike Cinderella or Peter pan, Ariel's Beginning contradicted far more than just the original series/sequels. It also contradicted the first movie, as well. You see, the plot of the movie simply could not in any way match up with any of the TLM related stuff, not even the first movie. For example, Triton's description of humanity (barbaric Harpoon-using fish-eaters) would imply that Ariel's mom was killed by humans for food, and possibly for the heck of it and enjoyment as well, but in Ariel's beginning, Athena had been run over by a ship, and whether they actually intended to hit Athena or not was never mentioned. They never even mentioned Ursula at all in that movie, (In fact, the only character who would have even been close in character to Ursula in that movie, Marina Del Ray, didn't even have the same punishment as Ursula [Marina was sent to rot in a cell for the rest of her life.], There didn't seem to be a ban on being near the shore at all (as evidenced by Marina being on the beach at one point), the daughters were completely mixed up, and Flounder's sudden change in personality was never even explained. Heck, even Ariel herself seemed very inconsistent (She didn't seem to have an interest of Humanity at all in this movie, not to mention, they never actually explained the Humanity obsession. Yes, I know that was explained in the TV Series, but if they were going to try and make the TV Series non-canon, they should at least write up a different backstory for her obsession.), The Musical concert in the first movie didn't seem to be that hyped up with the fact that there's music (If they were hyping up anything, it's the fact that Ariel now joined the Daughters of Triton band.). Speaking of her joining the band, since Ariel was pretty much the reason why Music even returned to Atlantica in AB, They would most likely have made Ariel the band leader of "Daughter's of Triton", instead of waiting until almost a year later to have her in it (as the daughter's lyrics implied that the Band that was interrupted by Ariel's disappearance was going to be Ariel's stage debut), among other things. That's not even taking into account AB's contradictions with the TV series and the Sequels. In fact, out of all of the mainstream collections of the TLM series (That is, the movie, it's sequel, the prequel, the Series, and maybe the books to a certain extent), this has the largest amounts of Plotholes in it. At least with the TLM series, and even the sequel, they tried to keep most of the things in the first movie intact. Ariel's beginning, on the other hand, had so many errors when comparing it to TLM and the rest of it's continuity, it's almost as if the creators weren't even trying to keep with the continuity of the first movie. Well, The musical doesn't seem too bad. I mean, it did make some differences with the original movie. Some necessary (I don't think they could have kept the Shark Scene even if they wanted to. I mean, they already had enough trouble getting Flounder's actor right, so it would be problematic to even have a shark scene. As a consequence, having Ariel do the Coup-de-grace is also necessary as well.). Some seemed very out of place for it and almost unnecessary (such as Under the Sea being moved directly after the little incident at the grotto.). However, even IF I were to find Ariel's Beginning a likable movie, I still think it shouldn't be counted as Canon to the TLM franchise, even IF it was made by disney, due to the ridiculous amounts of errors and contradictions in trying to compare it to the first movie. I mean, unless they try to completely remake TLM in order to fit AB into the timeline and retcon the series and the sequel [meaning, rewrite the entire movie], there's no way it could fit. Anyways, I saw the signature, and I still think that just their not looking at each other is not enough. If they want to keep to their policy, they shouldn't be next to each other in the same background. |
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Post by DanTheMan on Jan 23, 2009 1:44:27 GMT -5
I would say.....please wake me up with this TLM nightmare is over. No way never. Enough of the TLM remakes...additions...sequels...musicals.....rubbish nonsense crap. It is all awful. They are ruining everything, they wouldn't do this anyways I am sure. The age of TLM is over. Let it rest in the glory it still has left. I don't want anymore Ariel stories that are terrible. I don't want anymore oh it would be cool to have this. No it wouldn't it would suck, we'd be disappointed and annoyed at how bad Disney does this and that. Let it go people...let it go.... -rant over- The ONLY thing I am and would look forward to is the TLM dark ride they are putting in at DL and MAY put in at WDW. Without the risk of being destroyed by you in your rage lol.. I would have to disagree. Not that you aren't wrong, because it's your opinion, however, I don't feel that everything they have done outside of the first movie has been bad. I personally like having more depth to a character and story, and that's what that stuff provides. |
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Post by toons27 on Feb 9, 2009 0:42:30 GMT -5
I'm not sure how I feel about this idea. Only since Disney has a tendancy to make rubbish with their great characters to the point it's just unwatchable. If they had a great creatve team on board; I'd love to see what they'd come up with. But I SERIOUSLY doubt it XD I actually liked Melody, she totally got a raw deal XD I have to agree with fridamoonbeam b/c I'm not sure about this idea, either. It might be weird and awkward. And besides, I didn't like the Little mermaid 2. It's bad enough that it messed up the first movie. |
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I'm sure there will be things to look forward to in the future, like the ride, but it's very sad to see how messed up Disney is at the moment.
Daniel 
