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Post by Aquisha on Oct 28, 2008 13:06:20 GMT -5
Here are my comments:
I LOVE the story. The only thing that I'm having trouble with as I'm reading is keeping all the sub plots straight. I feel like even though each section has given more information, the presentation of that information is so segmented that I can't connect the new info to the overall storyline. Because there are so many characters to follow (Ariel, Eric, Daemon, Denny, Triton, Selene, Sebastian, Flounder, Urchin), it's really hard to see how they're all fitting in together without one section that explains what's going on with everyone. I don't know if I said this before, but it's like looking at one piece of a puzzle and not knowing how it fits in with the whole picture. That's especially with the few stray pieces of plot like what happened to Urchin or how the "Edymion" character ties with Denny.
That's the only "criticism" (and I use the word very lightly) that I have of the story. Basically for me it's just a little cryptic (and I know the reader isn't supposed to know everything, that's the point) and therefore a little hard to follow. But that would be it.
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Post by WickedElphie on Oct 28, 2008 14:15:25 GMT -5
*Nods* I know there's a lot of subplots going around. The next section should wrap up chapter eight and by the end of chapter nine, almost everyone is going to be in the same place. To make things a little less confusing here's a brief rundown of what characters are involved with what. Daemon is the human sorcerer who kidnapped Ariel. He seems to be an older version of Eric who learned magic after the tragic loss of his wife. The Siren or The Dark Siren according to Daemon is a dangerous admirer of Ursula's who is responsible for what happened to his Ariel. She found a way to get to alternate worlds and Daemon followed her. Selene is a sorceress who is originally from the sea but can change into human form. She keeps her hair and most of her face covered at all times. She claims that she wants to help Eric and the others find Ariel because of a debt between her family and King Triton's, but is clearly working with Daemon. She contacts Urchin and the others so they can meet up with Eric and leads the four of them to the Island. Endymion or The Sleeping King is an apparition of a human man under a curse that briefly spoke to Eric and returned to him the flute that had been thrown away before Vanessa hypnotized him. Flounder briefly meets a Young Mermaid with dark hair and a red-orange tail that looks like Ariel and is "not supposed to be here yet." If you think you know who she is, you're probably right. I will say that she likely won't be showing up again. Denny is a small boy that first appeared as a human on the Island who spoke to Sebastian and later as a merboy in Ariel's grotto. He seems to know Selene and has never met his father. He is protecting a human man inside a glass coffin and refers to King Triton as "Grandfather." A Fake Ariel and a Fake Eric attacked Urchin. Sometime later Eric runs across the Fake Ariel, but Urchin and the Fake Eric are nowhere in sight.
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Post by fridamoonbeam on Nov 1, 2008 13:19:57 GMT -5
Great chapter! And thank you for clearing everything up, that just made it all a little easier to understand. Should I be ashamed for how much I'm loving Daemon? ::hides:: There's something about a older, damaged, possibly evil, more angsty version that does it for me. lolz
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Post by WickedElphie on Nov 5, 2008 17:07:45 GMT -5
No need for shame. LOL.
Some major influences on this story are the BTVS episodes "The Wish" and "Dopplegangland" (which deal with an alternate reality where the main characters have either died, become vampires, or are much harsher good guys) and the character of Chris on Charmed (who was a time traveler from the future that nobody was sure was good or evil. It turned out he was good and Piper's future second son, but came from a world where her oldest son was an evil dictator.)
In other words I wanted to explore versions of the characters from places where happily-ever-after hadn't exactly taken hold.
Daemon in particular is also a little bit inspired by Angel (guilt, dark clothes, guilt, fierce temper and ability to kick butt, more guilt), Future Trunks from DBZ (loyal, desperate to change what happened and face his demons, not quite strong enough to do so at first), and Erik from Phantom of the Opera (more the obsessive love, not so much the strangling people).
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Post by fridamoonbeam on Nov 6, 2008 1:31:50 GMT -5
"more the obsessive love, not so much the strangling people"
Hahaha! Sorry that made me laugh. ^^
I can see all those influences for sure, but they don't dominate. I mean Eric did have a slight underlying darkness to him. He wasn't all rainbows and sunshine ready to save the day then ride... erm, sail into the sunset. No, he was more complex. I do love him in a darker tone, because you can tell it's there. ^^
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Post by WickedElphie on Jan 24, 2009 18:47:22 GMT -5
Yes, finally an update. This is the first couple chunks of chapter nine. Tomorrow I should at least have another section up, if not all the way 'til the end of the chapter.
Chapter Nine: Let Go
*It gains the more it gives And then it rises with the fall So hand me that remote Can't you see that all that stuff's a sideshow? Such boundless pleasure We've no time for later Now you can't await your own arrival you've twenty seconds to comply*-"Let Go-Frou Frou
Urchin struggled against his captor, but it was useless. The person he had originally thought to be Ariel had tackled him, forcing him under the water, which gave what had most definitely not been the prince a chance to change into its true form and wrap itself around him. Said form being that of an electric eelman. That his arms and tail to pin Urchin down, making it impossible to swim back to the surface and warn the real prince that he had walked into a trap.
So, let go, so let go Jump in
Unaware of Urchin’s presence just a few feet below the nearby waves, Eric studied the woman in front of him. Her physical features were identical to Ariel’s but as soon as she had moved and spoke he had realized that it wasn’t her. This woman moved with a snake-like poise that was nothing like Ariel’s artless easy grace. Her voice held the same bell-like cadence but it was all wrong just the same. The right note played an octave too high. Everything screamed that this was an imposter.
Her expression changed from determined to worried and confused. “What do you mean, who am I? it‘s me. What‘s wrong with you?”
Eric only shook his head in disgust. “Stop it. You‘re not her. You‘re not Ariel.”
She blinked once, then smirked evilly. Despite the continued physical resemblance no one would have mistaken her for the former mermaid now. “What gave me away?”
“They way you spoke, the way you moved. It was deliberate, rehearsed. Ariel doesn‘t plan, she just is. I‘ll ask you one last time, who are you?”
She laughed coldly (and Eric shivered inwardly, reminded uncomfortably of Vanessa). “You‘ll know my name soon enough, but there are more pressing matters. If you don‘t help him, one of your friends is going to die.”
Oh well, what you waiting for?
King Triton sighed. A short conversation had determined what he had needed to know. Denny *was* his grandson, at least in the world he and Selene had come from. Looking at the boy now that he knew, it was obvious. His coloring was undoubtedly Eric’s, but his features were very like his mother’s.
“Selene should have told me about you. I could have been looking after you from the start. ”
Denny shook his head, “She didn‘t want anyone to know. It‘s not that she didn‘t trust you, it‘s just that back home it‘s a big secret too. ”
The Sea-King’s eyebrow quirked, “Why exactly is that?”
Denny blushed. “No, it wasn‘t-it wasn‘t at first. It was after-with Daddy gone it wasn‘t safe to be on land and in the sea…but I’m not supposed to tell you things. She said not to. ”
King Triton nodded, sensing he had pushed the child as far as he would go for now. “All right, but would you answer just one more question?”
Denny kept his expression guarded. “Maybe.”
“What‘s your real name?”
He cocked his head in thought, then apparently decided answering would be harmless. “Aiden. Aiden Eelios.”
Oh well, what you waiting for?
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Post by fridamoonbeam on Jan 25, 2009 1:53:40 GMT -5
Yay! Updated! =) I can't wait to read the rest!
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Post by WickedElphie on Jan 25, 2009 19:47:22 GMT -5
“Which of my friends is going to die?”
The imposter (As Eric had mentally dubbed her) laughed again. “Perhaps *your* friend was the wrong choice of words. He isn‘t really. After all you only met a few hours ago.”
Eric‘s fists clenched in agitation. He ignored her comments and simply said, “Take me to him.”
She only waggled her finger in a chastising fashion. “Now now. Wait a moment. There‘s another option.”
“What is it?”
“Leave him.” She studied the look of shock and horror on his face at her pronouncement with an air of enjoyment before continuing. “If you come with me right now I‘ll take you to Ariel and I won‘t lift a finger to stop you from taking her back with you. Or save the boy and lose the chance to find your lover.”
For a moment Eric didn’t speak. Then he repeated, “Take me to Urchin. ” “Are you sure?”
Eric stared straight into her eyes and spoke. At first softly but gradually getting louder, “Yes. You were right, I haven‘t really known Urchin long enough to call him my friend, but from what I‘ve seen of him so far I‘d like to get the chance to in the future. Secondly, he is in fact a very good friend of the woman I‘m going to marry and I know for a fact that she‘d never forgive me for saving her at the cost of his life. And finally he is a living, breathing, thinking being and I would never let anyone die if I could prevent it from happening! So stop asking and Take. Me. To. Him. Now!”
The imposter glared, “What about Ursula? Did she deserve death?”
“I don‘t know that she did. All I know is that she was going to kill the woman I love and I was not going to let that happen. I had limited options. If I‘d known of a way to stop her without killing her maybe I would have used it. In the end it was me on a broken ship against a giantess that controlled the water and the lightening. I don‘t regret what I did, only that it had to be done. ”
She laughed one last time. Long and cold. “You do not regret? I promise you, you will. The boy is under the water struggling against a far stronger foe. Save him if you can.”
And she was gone.
Eric didn’t waste a moment before diving in the water. As he went under the waves he was surprised to feel his body seize up in transformation once again. This time at least he knew what to expect, and went completely limp as he allowed his lower body to shift into a merman’s tail. It was still painful, but more or less bearable.
Once the change was more-or-less complete he started scouting for any sign or Urchin. He saw two shapes in the distance and kicked off. He just hoped he wasn’t too late.
It's alright 'Cause there's beauty in the breakdown
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Post by fridamoonbeam on Jan 26, 2009 0:04:47 GMT -5
I really like that you made Eric's feelings about killing Ursula complicated. He is more of a gentle soul, but you can only push him so far before he doesn't care LOL Also, he likes Urchin okay. After all he would have no reason to worry about him XD
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Post by fridamoonbeam on Jan 26, 2009 0:17:07 GMT -5
Oh, just another thing; Is Deamon going to be making an appearnce soon. You sort of have me adicted to him
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Post by WickedElphie on Jan 26, 2009 1:30:19 GMT -5
Daemon will be in this chapter, never fear, but more towards the end.
As for his feelings about Ursula's death. I feel like Eric's generally not bloodthirsty at all, but if you threaten those he cares for-watch out.
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Post by fridamoonbeam on Jan 26, 2009 10:07:25 GMT -5
Yays! ::dances::
And yeah it would have to be something huge for Eric to become that ruthless. lolz
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Post by WickedElphie on Jan 27, 2009 18:31:02 GMT -5
Oops. Accidently hit Delete instaed of Modify. Ahh well.
Once Again:
New section! I should have another out late tonight. Also, I posted a one-shot called "A Scene From A Marriage." Remember that nothing inspires a writer quite like comments from the readers!
After what seemed like an eternity of being pinned to the sea-floor Urchin heard his up-‘til-now silent captor staighten up slightly and speak “Well it ssseemsss that your time isss up. If the human were going to come for you he would have by now. That meansss you‘re no longer usssefull. And that meansss that I get play.”
Urchin, who had given up fighting, began to struggle once more. He didn’t truly believe the others had given up on him, but he doubted that they would be in time to save him. He kept twisting, trying to break free of the eelman’s grasp.
The eelman only laughed as he moved in sync with Urchin, keeping him near the ground. “Oh yesss, the fear makesss it all the more fun. Fight me little merboy. Fight, although you know it‘s hopelessss.”
“I wouldn‘t say that.”
The eelman whipped around to where the voice was coming from, pulling Urchin with him. It was Eric. He had made it in time.
“Careful. He‘s incredibly strong. Watch yourself,” Urchin called out before his head was driven into the ground.
As he hissed in pain he heard Eric say, “Let him go. Deal with me. ”
“I sssupposse. I was getting bored with thisss one anyway.” The eelman grabbed Urchin by his underarms and flung him cruelly out in the distance.
Eric watched in horror but was still too far way to do anything but swim to the other boy‘s side when he landed hard on the ground.
He helped Urchin sit up. “You all right?”
“I’ll live. ”
“Got any tips on how to fight that thing?” Eric whispered.
Urchin answered in the same low voice. “Taking him by surprise? But unless the others are with you there‘s no one to surprise him.”
He sighed then looking at Eric suddenly pointed at his waist, “What‘s that?”
Eric looked down. Sure enough while he had been changed back into merman, this time the red band he usually wore around his pants had not disappeared and neither had the flute which Endymion had returned to him.
Eric grinned as he removed it from its make-shift holster and handed it to Urchin. “I think I have a plan. Lie back down like you‘re seriously hurt and listen. We have to hurry before our friend over there gets bored and decides he wants to start the fight.”
Sure enough Eric had barely finished explaining before a cold hiss broke out, “Come on boy! I thought you were going to fight, not play nursssemaid to the weakling.”
“Oh I‘m ready all right.” Eric glared at the eelman and mentally went through the plan once more.
And then there was no more time to think.
So, let go, yeah let go
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Post by Zavi on Jan 27, 2009 20:50:03 GMT -5
Yay, I've been meaning to comment on this for the longest time! -flexes fingers- Here goes.
I agree that there are too many subplots to follow, but things cleared up and I can see the big picture better. My advice would be to shorten the cast for anything in the future. It weeds out any confusion and makes the characters included much stronger.
I liked how you got the plot started very quickly. It didn't seem rushed or stumbled over; it was just right for the piece. Love the originality, too. All the magic can get a little mind-boggling, but I think that's just because I'm trying to follow every character.
Oh, and may I say I LOVE the fact that Eric knew that fake!Ariel was a fraud from the start? I never would have thought it would happen, but now that it did it seems so right. Eric knows her well enough to see the tiny mannerisms that no one can imitate. ^^
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Post by WickedElphie on Jan 27, 2009 22:27:51 GMT -5
Ahh yes, the subplot problem, It's kind of hard to address because what I'm trying to go for is an action/adventure/mystery/drama with a large cast of characters. Which unfortunately means that I have to deal with a large cast of characters. LOL.
However, despite appearances I mostly do know what I'm doing and who's where. And as I've said, at the end of chapter nine and beginning of chapter ten almost everyone will be in the same place.
Characterization-wise I have to admit that Flounder and Sebastian got the short end of the stick, but I've tried to give each player a moment in the spot-light.
Most of my ideas for future stories are less epic in scope, so I will probably have fewer characters running around.
I am glad that things have cleared up for you a little. Hopefully they'll continue to do so.
I know part of teh problem is the segmented nature of posting, so I'll hopefully have the chapters completed so far hosted on another site soon. Do you think having the finished chapters in one place where you can immediately proceed from one to the next would be helpful?
And last of all, thanks Zavi for taking the time to write such an honest and helpful review.
BTW I'm glad you liked Eric recognizing that someone was trying to trick him. I haaate how in most things if there's a body switch or an imposter no one notices. I wanted to kind of do a send-up of that by having Eric immediately know something was wrong.
Now for some more of Chapter Nine-Please go easy on me. This is my first fight scene and I'm not sure if I'm entirely happy with it.
Just get in
The eelman struck quickly and without warning. Eric barely dodged his first attack, ducked and tried to kick out with his fin, only to get a painful shock for his trouble.
“Right. Not gonna do that again.” He just managed to veer right, putting him out of the reach of the eelman’s tail, which was striking at him like some bizarre electric whip. They moved back and forth in the viscous underwater dance, one or the other landing a hit, but with no clear winner.
Finally Eric propelled himself slightly above his opponent and decided to go with that classic combat technique, the punch in the face. His hit connected but hurt his hand just as much, if not more than the eelman’s face.
But that was all right. It had caught his enemy‘s attention, which was all he needed it to do.
Out of the corner of his eye, he saw Urchin move into position behind the eelman and, at the opportune moment, strike him in the back of the head with the flute. And then strike again. And again.
Meanwhile Eric kicked at the eelman’s chest with his tail and threw more than a fair share of punches as well. It took a while, but under their combined attacks, the eelman finally went down, and stayed there.
Urchin was breathing heavily and was leaning his torso on his left arm. Most of his upper body was covered in scrapes and bruises. “Is he..?”
Eric was panting more than a little himself. He had a nasty black eye and his lip was bleeding. There were more than a few burns on his tail as well. He shook his head. “I don‘t think so, but I don‘t really want to be around to find out.”
“Yeah. Besides we should look for the others.” Urchin gingerly handed Eric back his flute.
“Are you all right to swim?” Eric asked, genuinely concerned, as he took it and holstered it back in his waistband.
“I‘ll make it. What about you?” Urchin responded, taking in the older boy’s injuries.
“I‘ve had worse. Let‘s go.”
Urchin had already started moving when he heard Eric say, “You were great back there. If it wasn‘t for you I‘d have been sunk.”
He smiled, a little pleased despite himself. Growing up an orphan, praise hadn’t exactly been flowing from people when he was a child. King Triton, Sebastian, Flounder, Ariel and the girls were the best surrogate family he could wish for, but he still didn’t really have a merman close to his own age to hang out with, or just talk to.
Urchin could tell Eric had meant what he said too, he wasn’t just trying to make him feel better. This human of Ariel’s was all right. “You too. If you hadn‘t come when you did I‘d just be splatter on the sea-floor.”
The conversation tapered off as the two started swimming in the direction Urchin pointed to as most likely being correct. They hadn’t been swimming long before they could spot the shadow of some structure above the water.
Urchin looked at Eric “Want to surface?”
Eric nodded, “Yeah but let me go first. You‘re more injured than I am. I‘ll come get you if it‘s safe.”
He wanted to protest but they’d lost a lot of time already, so he reluctantly agreed to wait. He didn’t have to wait long though. It seemed that Eric had only just raised his head out of the water before he was back down and waving at Urchin to join him, which he did as soon as he could.
Nothing could have prepared Urchin for what they would find up-top though. “Flounder? Sebastian?
Oh, it's so amazing here
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Post by Zavi on Jan 28, 2009 11:48:13 GMT -5
Having them one after another would definitely be helpful. I haven't read the story all the way through in a while, so I may have forgotten to mention a lot of little things. Can't wait to see how it looks in the big picture.
You're very welcome. I always make sure I touch upon as much as I can to help the writer--when I critique people's stuff, I almost always get an "Oh my God!" or "Holy crap!" because of the red pen all over it. I don't think I'm a nasty editor or anything, just one that gives as many suggestions as possible.
Aaah, I'm with you on fight scenes! They're so difficult and I'm awful at them. You did a great job at making this to the point, though. When they drag on, the excitement dies. Blech.
If there are any more in the future, my advice would be to watch your word choice. Good verbs make epic battles. ^^
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Post by fridamoonbeam on Jan 28, 2009 15:37:08 GMT -5
Yes, fight scenes ARE hard to write. Since you're needing to combine so many elements. And too much just makes you go like 'Okay, wrap it up.' XD But I think you handled it really well and gave both of them credit. Their little bonding scene is cute too. I'm sure Ariel would like too. No wonder you took so long to write this chapter. There's a lot in it! Which makes me excited.
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Post by WickedElphie on Jan 29, 2009 1:43:34 GMT -5
Yeah, Nine's kind of a difficult chapter 'cause it's where I'm transitioning from the exploring and meetings between charactersin the middle to setting up the confrontation with the real villain that leads into the end. AND it has the fight scene.
I'm glad that fight wasn't too terrible. I have it all choreographed in my head, but it's sometimes hard to bring that to the page.
But Chapter Nine is almost done though. The final section should be up tomorrow (well technically today but you know what I mean).
Look for the start of Chapter Ten by Tuesday at the latest. It'll probably be up earlier. *crosses fingers*
BTW Frida, how's Chapter Four of Things We Don't Plan For coming along?
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Post by fridamoonbeam on Jan 30, 2009 1:20:28 GMT -5
Yay! I can't wait for more. And thanks for asking, it's coming along. I still have more and trying to decided when and where things would happen is a hard thing for me. lolz
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Post by WickedElphie on Jan 31, 2009 1:30:08 GMT -5
Ahhh. Just PM me if you'd like to run anything by me, just to have a fresh perspective.
Now: The end of Ghapter Nine.
I'm really excited about it, so if you read it please comment and let me know what you think!
Ariel considered everything Daemon had just told her. She didn’t think he had been lying, but some points in his story had been a little vague. Had he just not wanted to revisit those moments in any more detail than he had to, or was there something else?
“Is there anything you‘re not telling me?”
Daemon blinked. “Anything I‘m not-?” A look of sudden horror came over his face. “No! Not here, not yet. It‘s too soon!”
Ariel was shocked at the sudden change in his demeanor. “What‘s too soon? Talk to me!”
“We have to go. Now.” He grabbed her arm and almost pulled her out of her seat before she had a chance to get up. He led her down a set of stairs at break-neck speed.
“Why? What’s the matter?” Ariel asked as she struggled to keep up.
“The Siren. She‘s here.”
It's all right
The last thing Eric had expected to find when he surfaced was Flounder and Sebastian resting in the shallows while Selene, in human form stood off to the side, near what seemed to be the moat and side-entrance of a castle.
“You‘re all here!”
Selene rolled her eyes, “Yes, your grasp of the obvious remains intact.”
Flounder missed her sarcasm, “Yeah. I met up with Sebastian a while ago and then Selene found us and brought us here. But, hey, you’re hurt! Are you okay? And where‘s Urchin? Is he with you?”
“I’m fine,” Eric laughed, “and Urchin‘s right behind me. I‘ll go down and tell him it‘s safe to come up.”
“You go and do dat mon.” Sebastian said, sounding a little weary from his various long walks and swims.
It was only a moment before Urchin joined the group and everyone was brought up to speed.
They were all in good spirits, except for Selene, who frowned at Eric’s tale of the Ariel look-alike and her eelman lackey. “You‘re sure about what you saw and heard?”
“As sure as I can be.”
“That‘s not what I was hoping to hear.” She took a breath and then put both left and right index and middle fingers to her temples. The small visible sparks of energy discouraged anyone from asking what she was doing.
When she was done, she turned back to the others and hurried to explain, “Ariel will be coming out that door in a moment with someone else. When they get here, we need to leave immediately. No matter what you see, or what questions you have, save them for later. Just be ready to swim on my signal.”
Selene then gracefully descended into the water, changing herself into a mermaid. The only sign she was in any pain was a slight shudder as she moved.
An instant later Eric saw Ariel rushing out the side door accompanied by-himself? Remembering Selene’s edict he confined himself to staring at his imperfect double in horrified fascination.
“We have to hurry,” his doppelganger gasped, “We need to-”
“Oh there‘s no need to do anything now.” called a familiar voice from the shadow of the castle. The false Ariel from earlier stepped into the light, staring at her matching prince with utter contempt. “As usual dear-heart, you‘re just a little too late.” 'Cause there's beauty in the breakdown
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